I think with Sandra winning best actress over Carey Mulligan allowed the Golden Globes to loose credibility IMHO

It was a ratings thing I think. I agree that the screenplay was very poor.

Oh, and I personally wouldn’t worry about it winning Best Picture.

If you look at the history of the precursors and Oscar history, an Avatar win for Best Picture shouldn’t come into the equation… which makes me glad. It should go to Inglourious Basterds or Precious

HFPA: “the most useless body in Hollywood”. RDJ’s win for Sherlock Holmes (awesome!) aside, I agree

So are you saying that all of the categories of film making mean nothing compared to screenplay? By that rational are you saying that every best screenplay winner should also be best picture? Could the technical aspects behind Avatar perhaps still make it a best picture despite its lacking screen play?

But I do agree with you on the Globes… they dont mean anything, but the Oscars should really show how Hollywood feels about Avatar.

Hey John,

Ross from Screen Rant here. Just watched your video and wanted to throw in my two cents:

I see what you’re saying about the HFPA not nominating Avatar for Best Screenplay yet giving it Best Picture. But what if it ALMOST got nominated? As in, perhaps if there was a sixth nomination then Avatar occupied that spot? And you said in your video yourself that the Best Screenplay of the year doesn’t have to be nominated and win Best Pictuure, because another movie may have been a lesser screenplay but vastly superior in other areas (cinematography, music etc). Perhaps the HFPA felt that Avatar’s screenplay wasn’t its strength but it excelled in other areas (which it did).

I was also a huge fan of Avatar, in fact it’s my second favourite movie of the year. Would I give it Best Picture? No, probably not. But I’m not MAD it won that award at the Golden Globes. It was still worthy to be nominated IMO.

But well thought and layed out in your video,

Cheers,

Ross Miller

David… did you even watch the video? In it i CLEARLY said:

“I’m not saying the film that wins best screenplay has to win best picture”

I also said:

“There are many elements that go into making a film”

I suggest watching the video again, and listening to it all the way through dude… then ask me something my man

Hey Ross!

Here’s my problem… let’s say that Avatar would have been the 6th nominated screenplay (that’s a huge assumption, but just for the sake of the discussion let’s go with it).

Yes, I would still have a problem is a body said that a movie only had the 6th best story, character, dialog, plot. etc. etc. etc. and yet was “Best Picture”.

What that tells me (in my opinion anyway) is that they don’t think story and character and dialog are important at all.

6th best story, characters and dialog… yet best movie? How low must they think of story and dialog and characters and plots?

But like I said my man… just my opinion.

I agree 100%. Avatar should have NOT won for best picture or for anything at all.

Avatar just beat Hurt Locker for best picture at the golden globes. Our decline into Mike Judge’s world of Idiocracy is in a much faster pace than anticipated.

I do love awards ceremonies even though I know most of them are silly and take themselves too seriously (reason why I loved Ricky Gervais presenting the Golden Globe) and yes, that film is subjective.

I, however, hated Avatar. Don’t get me wrong, I think it was visually amazing and it’s the future and etc etc. As a geek I’ve been waiting for this movie for quite a while and was completely disappointed with what I saw. I think not only the plot, subplot, characters, dialogues and story were awful but also that the pace was lost and (I usually don’t complain about this) that it was too long. Therefore, even though the movie is making s*** loads of money, I would NEVER expect someone in their right mind to give an award for best picture. I can’t imagine having to watch it again.

I actually don’t have a problem with the movie having being nominated, because it was a great accomplishment and fine fine everyone loves James Cameron. But honestly I vow with you to not watch the Oscar again if Avatar actually wins.

But overall I disagreed with most of the winners of the night. Sandra Bullock what a joke, best director James Cameron didn’t deserve it, I love Robert Downey Jr and I loved Sherlock Holmes but Michael Stuhlbar deserved it more and the fact they gave two nominations for Meryl Streep (who I think it’s great but It’s Complicated it’s not worth it).

The whole point is that the only amazing thing about the movie are the special effects. So, just give a special effects award and done deal.

John,

Fair enough, but I’m still sticking with that it was worthy to be nominated. But as I said I wouldn’t have given it Best Picture (IMO that was either Inglourious Basterds or Up in the Air, I was surprised the latter didn’t get it).

Btw, I was curious as to your line of thinking to do with a film being nominated for Best Picture should get nominated for Best Screenplay, too – every movie that’s been nominated in the last 10 years at the Oscars for Best Picture has also been nominated for Best Screenplay. And when was the last time that didn’t happen? Funnily enough with Cameron’s Titanic! Coincidence?…

John! You are so passionate about this! But prepare for the Oscars to do the same…… BOW to the Cameron! Ok anyway… I love your blog and videos and will just respectfully agree to disagree with you. No real explainations, I just LOVED everything about the film. But.. as we all know.. opinions are like asshole… everyone has one.. or it could be said opinions are like blogs.. everyone has one. What else would the internet be good for? Awaiting your next podcast where you will probably bring this up again

Well, what can I say? I’m not gonna be a liar, I didn’t watch the whole video, but I needn’t. What you’re saying ios the same thing that been reaching my ears for the pst few weeks. And once again, I haven’t watchedf the movie, but I watched Dances With Wolves, and I’m actually realy eager to watch Avatar.

But here’s what I think. It should be there. And it shall win the Oscar. Why? For what the ‘Best Picture’ represents. It’s not about the story. That’s why there’s ‘Best Screenplay’. It’s not about this nor that. It’s about a acomplishment as a motion picture. And that means the whole life of the project, since it’s creation, to it’s preproduction, to it’s production and it’s post production. From the way that it (I can’t find the right word here…but I’m going with the following)appeared in the media, to the box office digits. So I think that ‘Best Picture’ is really aimed to analyzing the picture as product instead of some piece of art (or story or anything that would enter the subjective area of individual pleasure). This may seem old, I don’t think that I’m the first telling you this, and this may seem biased, but that’s what I think.

It’s hard for me tho write what I really thing. I function better when discussing things personally.

But you should know that those prizes are not always aimed at a true avaliation of cinema, but more like some kind of market reaction to pictures (that can be seen as another kind of product).

Sorry for ranting and rapping without even watching the whole video, but I did so ‘couse int the depth of my mind I scream all time that I see that kind of movie recieving awards. Grato for the time.

And I mistyped lots of things, I’m sorry. And I haven’t really spoke english in quite some time, so I beg your pardonif there’s anything hard to understand in my speech. : )

I don’t see how anyone can really argue with you here John. It shows a lack of consistent criteria on the golden globes part for voting on both the nominations and the winners.

where’s the debate in that? just look at the nominations and the winners and it should be clear as day.

John,

One question: who would you have preferred to win?

Hey John I agree with you. I think the Hurt Locker probably should have gotten it. Avatar isn’t that revolutionary. Only its visuals.

hm. I just took a look at your year end top ten list and was surprised to see that you ranked Avatar higher than all of the other nominees except for Up In The Air. It was one spot above Hurt Locker. And as I recall, you hated Inglorious Basterds

I don’t disagree wit any of your points above but in this context it’s kind of splitting hairs. It can’t be the best film of the year because of its second rate script. But it can be in the top ten.

I’m not that big a fan of avatar by the way.

I am glad you brought up Titanic. If the Oscars can give the award for best picture to Titanic but not niminate it for the screenplay, then how are the Oscars any better than Golden Globes.

Well there are a number or reasons but I dont think the Golden Globes should be critcized for doing something that the Academy Awards does.

Hey Cloud,

It’s not something the Academy “does”, it’s something they did ONCE in their 70+ year history over 13 years ago and have never repeated the mistake again.

But like I said… if they do it this year I’ll be done with them.

Sound of music. 38th Academy Awards.

*sigh* ok, it also happened once 45 years ago. FORTY FIVE YEARS AGO.

My man, I’m not sure what your point is. I don’t think the Oscars should get away with it and the Globes shouldn’t. I’ve already said that if the Oscars do it this year I’m done with them.

First is you seem to have it in for The Golden Globes. It seems like you are nitpicking every little detail. We get it, you think they are useless but they don’t do everything wrong.

Also sometimes movies may not have the best screenplay but still manage to be good movies. Movies are a sum of all their parts and what they lack in one area they can make up in another.

I haven’t seen Avatar so I cant really be a judge on the quality of that film. But I did see Titanic and i loved it. The love story at its core may have been a bit formulaic but when everything comes together it becomes a great movie experience. So no, I would not fault The Academy Awards for giving that best picture and not nominating for it’s writing. If Avatar is the same way I wouldn’t fault The Golden Globes for doing the same thing.

And for the record I don’t care for the Golden Globes. I realized that when they found a way to nominate Beyonce for her acting skills. In that same year they nominate Leonardo Dicaprio twice for best actor. Hypothetically if Russel Crowe released five movies in a year then he could have all the nomination slots. I can’t respect a award show that would allow that to happen.

Ah, I miss these wonderful rants. Haven’t seen “Avatar” and I won’t until the hype dies down. I agree it does really discredit the Golden Globes in that area. From everything I’ve heard ( not just here), “Avatar” really has nothing going for it other than visuals. But it’s a style-obsessed world nowadays. I have a message that I’d like to spread, and I think you’ll agree with me on this, John.
THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LIKING A MOVIE, AND CONSIDERING IT A GOOD MOVIE.
Example: I like “Batman Forever” because it’s stupid fun with a pair of actors I enjoy. But there is no doubt in my mind that it’s a VERY bad movie. Granted, because film is subjective and everyone has their own opinion, and there is no real ‘higher power’ to determine a film as good or bad, this is a difficult concept to grasp for some people. And here’s another example for you. I didn’t like “Braveheart.” I didn’t like it. But there is no doubt in my mind that it was a good movie. The acting was great, the action was good, the script was fine, etc. etc. But I just didn’t like it. “Spirited Away” may have been the best film Hayao Miyazaki ever did, but I didn’t like it as much as “Porco Rosso.”
Sorry to go off-topic, just wanted to put something out there.

I agree with you man. Avatar was insanely beautiful visually but the dialogue was shit. Some part were extremely awkward and unoriginal especially with Michelle Rodriguez. The story was also unoriginal. I think District 9 should have been up there, it was greatly written, excellently acted and the story was full of originality. Though in the end I would give the winner to the Hurt Locker.

I just want to know if you had fill Avatar’s spot on the nominees, what films would you have up there for Best Picture and which film would you choose for the Best Picture.

Hey castle91,
I’m sorry, but it kind of seems like you’re contradicting yourself when you say that Braveheart’s acting, action, and script were good and yet you didn’t like it.

I mean to me that’s like saying. “This comedy was funny, and yet I did not like it.”

I know it’s a complicated concept. I just set my personal feelings aside from my opinions of the quality of a film. By the sum of it’s parts, Braveheart is a good film. But I don’t care to watch it again. “The Dark Knight” is a great film. But I like the 1989 “Batman” better. Sorry, but I can’t seem to explain it better than that.

the title of this post should be “how in the fuck can avatar be in serious contention for anything other biggest joke in cinema history”

this film is so epically bad you wait and see how people turn on this thing once it hits dvd.

Hey Alfie… good to see you.

Well… I had too much fun watching the film to agree with you outright. I might feel differently after I watch it on a TV. We’ll see.